Horatious

Well.. Backstory = The world is instanced, meaning that once a set number of people enter an area, a new copy of that area is created to accomodate people entering at a later point..

Which means that you CANT find people the way you want too.. If your guildies come online, ya´ll travel to a random city for a meetup, stand on the exact same spot, there is a big chanse you wont see eachother since you are in different "instances" of said city..

You can manually change "instances" to meet up with your peeps, to hunt down a player, to find a mob that you need for a quest and so on.. And vice versa, you can change instances to escape from pvp if you wanna.. All it takes is a loadingscreen..
But not experience a populated world..
I mean, serverselection will mean fucking nothing when it comes to socialising..


Fucking hell this makes me dissapointed beyond comparison..

callumf

Ouch

Kind of like Guild Wars then?

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Horatious

Never played guildwars, so not a clue.. Tabula Rasa has (had if they changed it) a similar system with multiple instances of the same zone.. And that was defenitely what made me cancel any thoughts of playing it, even tho its in all respects a great game othervise..

Aeribian IV

Believe AO had it as well, biiiig empty area's

Generally means they can cut server costs I presume

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OS-Jeremias

also might have something to do with collision detection

but not being a big fan of multiple zoneinstances I think I go to aeribs "cut costs make more money" theory

it all depends how they really make it work, if it is like Tabula Rasa that you can always
switch zones to several that there is that might be bit a turn off

tho if it is just "make new instance whenever population exeeds certain amount (like 150-250 people per zone)" it might not be all that bad

Horatious

*Join´s guild ventrilo*
- Hey guys, anyone wanna meet up at Old Rock and do some pvp ?
- Sure dude..

*10 mins later*

- Man, where the hell are you, ive been here waiting for ages..
- What, im here too, loads of people running around, cant see you.
- ...

Ofcourse they do it because they cant support to many people in the same area due to the coding, and how the code is to crappily done in terms of work on todays computers/servers..


As it works today, you can change instances with a simple /command and a mouseclick.. People are already complaining that you can do it in combat even, hence being able to grief someone and just dissapear to another instance of the same zone..
I guess they will limit the way you can change instances later one, they have to to make the pvp even work decently, but how the HELL are you even gonna be able to have a working community on server, down to guild and even party, level with this shit ?


That has ALWAYS been the big gain with WoW when it comes to MMO´s, you do have a seamless world that all people share.. Anything else = stoneage, diablo 2 mmo gaming..


Fucking hell im bummed at the moment..

Kaelith

that.sucks.majorly.

Death

seems to be a tend at the moment with mmos - most likely down to the server requirements and reducing lag, though i don't think you can truely call games that do this "MMO"s as it effectivly removes "Massive" from the name and you end up with a multiplayer online game

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Horatious

I relised that most of you reading this cant get into the betaforum anyways, so i edited out the link to the thread in the op..
And yeh, i think so too Death, its easier/cheaper for them to instance stuff and make fewer servers than to actually do the wow/vanguard/eve thing with the world and let it be truly mmo..

callumf

tbh I reckon this will seriously kill AoC for most players.

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Kimi

Or... To decrease the client load...
They probably want to avoid WBB/Luna style lag-fests.
Also, it would encourage people to use other areas of the world, rather than all gravitating to central areas, and not being able to meet people because of the instancing.

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Aeribian IV

WBB/Luna hasnt happened since UO, whose servers are ancient. Theres just no excuse for that sort of lag anymore.

And the excuse thats its to stop people gravitating is rubbish, all it means is they will gravitate to the same places but they just wont see everybody else.

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Aeribian IV

Eve and Vanguard cant really be used as an example, as they probably have less players combined than one instanced area......

But I also agree with

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callumf

umm

In LOTRO pvp area there are lag spikes when you get 100+ players in one Castle where the frame rate is down to like 1 frame per second - and I really mean that - its surreal like watching a succession of still images.

So lag really is still a big issue in these new processor hungry games.

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Horatious

What i cant understand however is the fact that the last gen games like for example wow can handle a non-instanced world..
Fuck progress in terms of graphix and new cool gamemechanics if it means we have to take leaps backwards in terms of how the world works..
I mean, i can totally live with the fact that the world has alot of zones, that comes with highend graphics and mechanics.. Loadtimes arent the problem, they are in every game..

Of course you will have lagspikes when there is enough people/toons in the same general area, and those areas are bound to be in every game.. However, its really pisspoor gamedesign to alleviate the problem by making instances of that area.. Better, easier and defenitely more rewarding for the game as a whole to spread out points-of-intrest in the world.. Like Blizz did with AH´s in all major cities. Took away loads of problems with a laggy Orgrimmar..

AoC however is designed with very few areas, and not the huge, seamless world they "promised" us.. So while i do understand the need for instances, i absolutely hate it as it takes away the mmo of the game..

Also, lets ponder all the things that will happen with multiple instances..

Communitywise:
* You cant run into friends/foes even if on the same map..
* You will have an extremely hard task of hunting people down..
* Griefers will have the chanse to escape you trhu a simple /command and/or a dropdownmenu..

Mechanicwise:
* You can search thru the instancelist for places where your mobs are spawned so you can finish quests quicker/easier..
* Raidbosses will/can spawn in several instances, meaning a guild has to camp multiple places for the kill, and possible even kill the mob several times a day/week/whatever..

And so on.. to tired atm to give more examples, but you catch my drift on how the system can and WILL be abused..
Theres a debate on how chatsystem and what the playercap will be per instance and how they will spawn.. We dont know yet, FC doesnt tell us anything..

However, there are basically two ideas of thought..

1. A set number of instances, and players zoning into the area gets evenly distributed..
2. A dynamic handling, which means that when one instance becomes full, the next one spawns and so on..

Which would you prefer ?

1 - means that you have a very spread playerbase in terms of friends/foes etc..
2 - that people in the new instance has a helluva lot easier time both playing the game due to load and the fact mobs are uncamped..


Gamingwise its a brill idea, will make the serverload be much less and players will in general have a much better time playing the game.. MMO-wise its a fucking nightmare..

I play MMO´s for the social aspect first and foremost.. Lets all be honest.. Would we play games like UO, WoW, eve and the likes if they were singleplayer ?? Fuck no, Morrowind is a insanely better game in that respect, and its what, 8 years old ?

Anyways, im ranting and we really dont know how the system will work on retail, just the fact that its in place now, and will be later on too..
I´m just really, really worried since i had high hopes for AoC..