Griinshar

Erm, I was just wondering.. Why everyone has nerfed thief's so much in CoRe RoE.

Today, I was at stonekeep and I stole a Exceptional Kyrss because no way I could steal 1300 gold [13 stones] at 50 stealing. I then within seconds got told i'm not alowd to and had to give it back..?

I mean, I searched the new RoE and found nothing like that! She didn't even have a yellow bag!

I think it's becoming a bit of hand and ridiculous.

Klion D'Gar

Grd doesnt follow the RoE. We have our own rules.

An answer you could have got from your GM since he obviously spoke to you about it.

Snubson

kk, getting bored of these threads.

you have a gripe or problem, GM's through ICQ = best way of action. Not creating threads whining about things. Thanks.

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Henry Winter

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Crush your enemies, see them driven before you and hear the lamentation of their women!

Griinshar

So it's not a rule? I'm confused!

Anyway, I'm planning on changing to assassin, Too many rules on thieve!

Cal Soulshadow

Nerf thieves? Yeah I agree. They are way too overpowered.

Wait, that wasn't what you were saying...?

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Griinshar

...!

But really, Everyone's been saying 'Bring thieves back into the community' and all it's drove me to do is to not bother with thief which I looked forward to!

Moturdrn

**New Rules of Engagement**
Nothing there about weaps, for the signatories anyways (unless they've put the weapon into the yellow bag of course.)


Assassin:
Just remember that bit there in the case of the signatories, unless of course theres the following involved:

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Floria

That's the reason why I'm not a fan of RoE (any brand of it). Not that the intentions behind RoE itself are bad, but people just love to take RoE as a reason to whine and play RoE lawyer or just to rub "I am better than thou" in your face.

What's so bad when someone steals an ordinary kryss from you? Keep cool and go with the flow and RP along. Following RoE doesn't make you a good roleplayer. Knowing when it makes sense to follow RoE and when it makes sense to rather stay IC and go along with what happens makes you a good RPer.

and some spontaneous RP is always > than all this OOC RoE lawyering, no?

Klion D'Gar

If the stealing was actually roleplayed instead of something akin to what I might expect in Felucca, I would agree. However in my experience, theres very few thieves who actually ROLEPLAY at all - they simply use it as an excuse to be complete tards. If I ever find such a thief, I will let you know.

That aside, I am a firm believer that if you have rules they need to be enforced. If you fail to enforce the rule once, then it becomes a pointless rule as when you DO come to use it, said thief will simply state that no one had a problem in the past.

You can call it being a 'RoE Lawyer' if you like, but if I rode into town now maxxed out with magic loot (which my character 'discovered in a mystical cave' for roleplay purposes) and killed you, I daresay you'd be the first to cry - and I wouldn't blame you.

Spontaneus roleplay shouldn't require you to break the rules since very little of the quality roleplay that has taken place in this game (from my pov) has ever required rule to be broken.

Floria

I think you misunderstand my intentions. I'm by no way a "AHAHA NO RULES!!!" anarchist.

However I would prefer if people would stay IC over a rule break that does not cause them serious grief over going "OMG HE BROKE ROE!" at the first chance they get. Just use your head and respect your fellow player and remember that thing called common sense.

Now for your example:
Obviously someone who is maxxed out with magic gear and thinks it will be fine with other players does lack common sense as well as respect for your fellow player's enjoyment of the game. I would not tolerate this either - I'm not advocating blatant rule breaks that spoil anyone's fun.
But a magic weapon that is not stronger than a GM weapon? fine with me. Does this spoil anyone's enjoyment of UO? Unless you're a whiner who loves to document even the slightes rule abuse, I doubt it.

Griinshar

It's very hard to 'roleplay a thief' a thief in real life isn't exactly gonna come up to you and go 'Hello there! Just taking your gold.. wahey..' - They're gonna stay hidden and sneak up on you!

You find me a thief in real life who wears a top hat and shouts good day!

Roleplaying a thief is hard enough with RoE, Tag readers..*Reads title: Thief*
*Runs away..*

Klion D'Gar

A thief is harder to roleplay convincingly, that is true. Some roles are much harder to play than others, anything that relies on emoting and language is very challenging - but when you pull it off it's also the most rewarding.

I might create a thief myself and see if I can do it any better. Might be amusing.

Klion D'Gar

The problem with that is that each person will have different views on where to draw the line. The only way to please everyone is to follow the rules hard and fast - if the VICTIMS want to be flexible, thats up to them. But if they don't want to be then they shouldn't be called RoE Lawyers for simply enforcing the rules.

Floria

you're right.
On Catskills we called them ROEplayers

I wouldn't be so enthusiastic for the "less rules" idea if I would not have it seen work. I think it was from mid 2000 to '03 that we had this system working on Catskills between a couple of major guilds (Black Rose Society, Paladins of Trinsic, Emerald Empire (aka RP1), Kingdom of Winterfell, Independents, Shadowclan, Undead, Drow, Shadow Rangers and a couple of smaller guilds), probably a few hundred players alltogether.

We had tough player screening on joining the guilds and GMs who dealt with any complains, but in the end it worked quite well and the quality of RP improved a lot. Problem handling was done through the GMs who used common sense rather than stiff rulesets to judge problems. There were also much less whine threads. I loved it