Sally Buttons

Please hurry to this page and sign the petition.
If you drive a car, please read -
Sarah Kennedy was talking about this proposed car tax scheme on Radio 2.
Apparently there is only one month left to register your objection to the 'Pay As You Go' road tax.

The petition is on the 10 Downing St website but they didn't tell anybody about it. Therefore at the time of Sarah's comments only 250,000 people had signed it and 750,000 signatures are required for the goverment to at least take any notice.

Once you've given your details (you don't have to give your full address, just house number and postcode will do), they will send you an email with a link in it. Once you click on that link, you'll have signed the petition.

The government's proposal to introduce road pricing will mean you having to purchase a tracking device for your car and paying a monthly bill to use it.

The tracking device will cost about ?200 and in a recent study by the BBC, the lowest monthly bill was ?28 for a rural florist and ?194 for a delivery driver. A non working mother who used the car to take the kids to school paid ?86 in one month.

On top of this massive increase in tax, you will be tracked. Somebody will know where you are at all times. They will also know how fast you have been going, so even if you accidentally creep over a speed limit in time you can probably expect a Notice of Intended Prosecution with your monthly bill.

If you are concerned about this Orwellian plan and want to stop the constant bashing of the car driver, please sign the petition on No 10's new website (link below) and pass this on to as many people as possible. Sign up if you value your freedom and democratic rights -

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Lenore

well it looks like they have enough signitures now i added mine for good measure though sneaky buggers putting this out without announcing it

Cal Soulshadow

I've signed even though I don't have a car. It's scary shit.

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Griinshar

I don't drive, Being 15 and all but I think it's a good idea.

I mean, Imagine you only used your car say once a week then your going to benefit from this alot. Now i've no idea what kind of prices are being paid now but to me it seems a good idea.

It stops all the idiots that whiz past me on my bike in a 30 mile area. And all the idiots that jump red lights. There are only two reasons to be really concerned about this and that is;

1. You use your car lots and lots and don't want to pay that much!
2. Your one of the idiots above.

And we're all concerned with this 'Big brother' feel to it, But face it that is the future unfortunately we are already watched all day on CCTV whether we like it or not. I don't feel that CCTV is a bad idea either because the only reason to not like it is if your doing dodgy stuff that you shouldn't be doing anyway, Else you'd have nothing to hide and would love CCTV.

Cal, Really you shouldn't sign the petition if you don't have a car all your really doing there is off-balancing the petition and making it unfair. That's a bit like petitions at my school, All you see are names like 'Donald Duck' and 'Santa Claus' you should only sign if it affects you.

And can someone tell me what you pay currently per month? Because when you were talking about a delivery driver only paying so and so and a mother paying this and that I thought it was a good idea. I actually thought you were for it until i looked back and saw 'Object;.

Cal Soulshadow

Not really. I disagree with it. And I do having a driving license, so I have the option of getting a car. I just don't think it's worth it in London.

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Futt

OK so I know this isn't the Hornet's Nest and all... But I just find this statement (and man, do I hear it a lot) so infuriating. "Comply Citizen! If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear". They keep shoving one draconian surveillance and monitoring scheme after another down your throat, and you just swallow. Cause the government knows best. They are infallible. And it's not like there are real humans with an agenda at the helm or anything, big brother is just some omnipotent being watching it all, looking out for your best interest right?

And what about surplus information? Will your wife be able to subpoena the tracking data for the divorce settlement, to prove you've been frequenting red light districts, visiting your mistress or something? Will police now stop setting up radar/laser speed check points, and just have the system automatically mail you a fine if you went over the limit (the system is infallible of course, so you can't dispute it)? There are so many ways this system can (and will) be abused it's not even funny.

To quote old Ben Franklin, "Those who would sacrifice essential liberties for a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." If you feel that the little temporary safety granted you by such an intrusive measure is worth sacrificing your freedom and privacy for, you deserve neither. I suggest they film the next round of "Big Brother" at Griinshes place.

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http://www.futt.org/

Lenore

I don' t drive either but i still don't see this as fair. For tax at the moment the most you can expect to pay according to the website for a petrol car is ?210.00 for 12 months and thats for one with an evil pollution rate. but for the mother who takes her kids to school under the new scheme it would cost her ?972 regardless of how enviromentaly friendly her car was thats an extortianate jump.
this is where i got the info for car tax from by the way
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Motoring...le/DG_10012524

As for how this would affect me seeing as i dont drive well prices on buses and taxis would go up. I doubt supermarkets would be able to offer deliveries now as it wouldnt be cost effective for them or the price would be hiked up beyond belief. Meaning i would have to go to the nearest supermarket and then struggle back on the bus with 3 kids and a weeks worth of shopping not an easy thing to do. Lets face it almost everything we use eat drink etc gets carried on the road at some point so all prices will rise to account for the extra costs it will not just effect drivers who use there cars too much everyone will end up paying for it

angels_and_daemons

I love that the government come up with idea's to track us and "keep us safe" or whatever and yet we have to pay to have them installed in cash or go to jail... ID cards and Tracker systems... Why do we have to pay for these things when we already pay a HUGE amount of tax each? That's right because the current government blew all our money on hookers for Blunket and Prescot...

They say the tax will be for the environment - what has money somehow gained the ability to convert carbon dioxide into oxygen? Perhaps they'll build wind farms and close down all those profitable powerstations that earn them tax revenue - then they can tax the people more... to pay for other green things... how about we give them 100% of our earnings and work as slaves...

I already pay around 40% of my income on tax (well when I had a job I was) not counting VAT, or Road tax, or Duty on alcohol, or Airport tax, or the indirect cost of the tax I pay to utilities companies, or Insurance tax... When does it end?

And this arbitary tax is per mile... not based on emissions... they just did a tax hike based on the size of engine (though again, not on emissions - oops) so will we end up paying twice? And why does a motorbike which has a very small effect on the road surface and the environment pay as much per mile as a 6 litre sports car with extra wide tyres if it's road tax (for the maintainence of roads) or environmental tax (to keep the greenhouse emissions down)?

And why do this without providing an alternative... public transport already costs so much money it's rediculous... but they have vehicals that travel many miles a day so the cost of that will rise... so people will end up sucking in thier gut and taking it because while stupidly expensive to run a car it will still be cheaper than public transport.

And Sally didn't a million people march on London protesting the war on Iraq? the government even went onto say that the people of Britain supported the war... even when a million people took the time out of thier day to go into london and complain, they decided the anti-war folks were a tiny minority... a petition unless it had 65 million signatures saying they'd rip every politician limb from limb if this went ahead wouldn't get even a seconds attention.

angels_and_daemons

I should say I have signed it to make sure... but I still doubt unless every british citizen was to sign it that Blair will even notice it

Aeribian IV

Gotta agree with Angels here, just because you have signed it doesnt mean that it will even take notice


You know they have already designed and tested a system right?


And in principle road charging is a good idea, but it means they should get rid of all the other tax's we have, such as petrol and car tax and such thigns. Otherwise its just another cost

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Aeribian IV

Plus, you need another alternative for them to even take notice...

No point in just saying No and not trying to solve the problem

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Griinshar

Excuse me but your quoted are completely misleading, You are saying in your first example, The current example that that's how much petrol is. Are you also saying that the mother buys 972 pounds worth of petrol? why don't you add the tax in for 12 months atm on top of the petrol, Very misleading and very misunderstood.

Aeribian IV

No you have just misunderstood

At the moment the car tax costs ?212, exclusive of petrol
under the new scheme it would cost ?972 for the road travel pricing, again not including petrol

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Griinshar

Yes, I understand that.

What I am saying is that he has got two different values:

Petrol Under this system

Petrol + Tax Under The New System

And compared them unfairly, I would like to see Petrol + Tax Under this system.

Lenore

I was using the tax price from a car that takes petrol as an example rather then one that takes diesel as im assuming most people that drive do so in petrol cars. A diesel car is in a different tax bracket as is a lorry and so on. The post had nothing to do with the price of petrol or indeed diesel now or ever does that make more sense? sorry if i got confusing