Glademist

NO LONGER UPDATED. UPDATED part is on THESE FORUMS.


Hello everyone visiting our forums.

There are people in the server interested in PvE raiding, they are in Stormspires, in Broken pact, in many small-size guilds, and some of them are naturally skillless, while some of them are pretty stable and knowing their class well.

Point is: since the raiding practically ended with the Jexies leaving the raid alliance, i would like to create a new raid alliance which would include guilds and single persons if they prove interested and agree to a certain limit of rules .

The general idea would be:
2-4 raids a week with possibility to attend 2 of them. Raid days to be sorted later. Mostly 19.00-23.00. At least 2 raids a week for TK / SSC / BT /MH / Gruul/ HKM.
Dedicated role for the raid alliance. Dps / healer / tank. Will to stay that way and get the gear first to do best.
Dkp-type loot assignment - bid hybrid.
Moving the raids to the easiest bosses of all available instance, that is ZA, SSC, TK and the few starting bosses of BT and MH.

If you are able to attend two days a week to a raid and find love in doing a role for the raid please sign here with your prefered role and post secondary gears since i am sure we will lack healers at first.

Please do so so that we have some base to start.
I will play out the add on the realm forums too to have a idea of interest. I will talk to Snub if i catch him, and since i dont have his MSN will do it ingame through someone.

I will mention only one character per real person to keep correct counts. This would be the minimal setup.

Total count: 8

Warriors: 2+
Arms / Fury: 1+
Prot: Zagar
Paladins: 3
Holy: +, +
Retri: Glademist
Prot: +
Shamans: 3+
Enhance: Snub, +
Resto: +, +
Elemental: +
Priest: 3
Disc: Guido, +
Holy: Mierka , +
Shadow: +
Druids: 3
Feral: Silversage, +
Resto: +, +
Balance: +
Mages: 3
Xganoth, +, +
Warlocks: 3
+, +, +
Rogues: 3
+, +, +
Hunters: 2
+, +

Will update based on replies.

DKP system:

Head start:
people will start at zero. No matter the guild or role.

DKP gaining:
Karazhan: only DKp based on the Common rules (see below) is gained.
Zul`Aman: only DKp based on the Common rules (see below) is gained. Hex lord yelds 2 points, Zul`Jin 4.
Gruul`s lair: 12 points for High King Maulgar and Gruul
Serpentshrine covern: 15 points for every boss in SSC and TK, double points for Vashj and Kael
Outdoor bosses: 15 points for Kazzak, Doomwalker, Magtheridon
* Need to keep better geared people motivated to join the raid. Badges alone arent a motivation imho.

Common:
1 point for every hour spent in instance
5 points for every hour spent on completely new boss
2 points for start log
2 points for end log
6 points bonus for staying for whole raid

Extra points:
double points for killing a boss for the first time (alliance -wise, not per character)

Points are awarded by the leaders AFTER the raid, that means you cant bid with the points you dont have yet.

Item costs:
1 point - BoP blues , BoE blues
10 points - epic items
20 points - Tier 4 tokens
40 points - Tier 5 tokens

Item Priorities:
Priority 1) Classes, that the item was intended for. Reguires "class" in its description.
Priority 2) Main role of the character in the raid alliance. Ie tanking / dps / healer items.
Priority 3) All those with positive DKP.
Priority 4) Anyone can bid (even if it means getting negative DKP). Mainly at head start.

Codex of loot delivery:
- Be reasonable during the bidding, be aware of gear of your guildmembers and in case its only marginally upgrade for you and big for somebody else think twice before bidding. Use MaxDPS.com - World of Warcraft Gear Rankings for this or another page you prefer. In the head start we want to averagize the gear among the raid alliance members. The better the average quality the higher chance of a fluent wipe-free raid. Consider this as a tip, not a rule.
- Raid Leader or Masterlooter has a right to stop and annulate the bidding in case of clearly off-topic bid. The right is reserved and non negotiable.

General Bidding Rules :
- Bidding on items to sell them or put in the Auction House is forbidden. If detected, will result in punishment. We want to improve the raid alliance as first priority.
- You cannot give up on a bid - if you win, you recieve the item and DKP are deducted from your DKP pool. You can however pass untill the end-bidding is reached, the person you bidded against will pay his first DKP offer, not your artifically heightened one.
- Bidding starts when the raid leader says so.
- Bidding over another player will cost double points. Ie 1 - 2 - 4 - 8 - 16 - 32 - 64. You can overbid anyone, but keep that in mind. If you want to bid the same number as the previous bidder. You take a roll for the win which will be made by the raid leader. Example situation. Tier 4 token drops from Curator and 2 members of the raid want the item. Member A wants the item but doesnt need it badly, so is willing to offer only 30 points. Member B wants the item too, and has to think now if he wants the item at a 50% chance for 30 points, or double the bid securing the item for himself, unless Member A will raise too. The example could end like this: A: 30, then B: 60, then A: hit 60 and roll, OR double again OR pass. You cannot get into minus with this option. This can be subjected to change.
- Keep the raid channel clear while the bidding takes place.
- If noone bids after bid-closure, item is disenchanted if its BoP or put into the raid alliance bank if its BoE.
- If two(or more) people have the same number of points, and want to bid ALL of their points, they can all roll and the winner gets the item and has all of his points removed. This removes the "first person to bid wins" situation
Borrowing DKP from another members of the raid is not possible.

Bidding has several phases that go through from the start to the item delivery.
Phase 1 - raid leader announces the item that is in question and its starting price in DKP.
Phase 2 - everyone that is interested in the item and has the minimum DKP for it make a BID with a proper number in the raidchat. The proper bid in this case is the nominal price, or double right away.
Phase 3 - If no one wants to pay more then the nominal price, at this point the bidding ends and a ROLL is made to assign the loot.
Phase 4 - If someone decides he wants to have a bigger chance at getting the item he can RAISE to double DKP price
Phase 5 - other persons interested can either CALL him, equalling his bid and get a chance at a ROLL even at the higher price. The one who RAISED and everyone that BIDDed in the first time has a chance to CALL or RAISE again untill either everyone CALLS, or only one person remains with a RAISED offer.
Phase 6 - the item is delivered to the highest bidder or a ROLL winner. DKP is taken from that persons acount.

DKP penalties :
- you can loose DKP for misbehave in raids, not paying attention to raid leader warnings and similar stuff
- also you can be awarded a penalty for repeated breaking the sanctity of the raid chat, extreme verbal offenses and similat stuff.

Raid behavior:
We understand for many of our members are the raids completely new experience so we decided to unify some basic code of conduct in these events.
- when the raid is planned at some preset time, try to arrive just on time, its polite to all the others.
- the time set is mainly the start of the invites so stay calm and patient, gathering such a big group can take much time and effort. Its normal if the run itself starts about one hour after the invites. The first pull should happen in 30 minutes from the invite time.
- if you dont have enough time expected for the whole run, pls tell it to raid leader or some officer, we will try to get replacement waiting, but we really need to know before the run.
- always repair, restock with needed items (casting ingredients, arrows, ankhs etc.) before the run and have some money with you for the Repair bot while in the instance.
- raid chat will be clear during the run, only officers, MT and MA are allowed to talk in there. Also some really vital things (like unexpected need to leave) are considered proper too. We dont want to be harsh in the beginning but later on we will strictly enforce this rule.
- raids instances are long and tough so be patient, dont show much nervosity and rudeness, we all need to focus and fight in friendly atmosphere.
- Logs will be taken throughout the raid and posted in the Raid Organization forum, after the End of a raid everything related to the raid will be inserted into the DKP-Database and you will have to check whether the entries concerning you are correct.

Please feel free to comment or offer your ideas.

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Time is the fire in which we burn.

Guido

Well you can always count on me as a healer really.

I'm disc specced right now but with my gear my healing is pretty decent, never had trouble with the 25mans or 10 mans up to now. Ofcourse I can respec whenever it is needed so no problem there (thank the dailies!). In this build with buffs and pots i reach around 1900+ heal. I make up for it with about 13k mana and coupled with a shammy its hard to run out of mana on any boss. But like I said I can respec whenever. I am a priest after all and a healing geared one at that.

I might not be signing up lately cause its easter over here so never know really what I'm gonna do with all my friends on leave from their jobs but most likely at our raiding times and especially during the week I'm always available! So you can pretty much count on me showing up 100% when needed. And that's only till the middle of the coming week tbh.

So, one dedicated healer for raiding is here!

Snubson

From what I can gather from the post...looks a good idea. IF can keep the people "whipped" into the none whining sorts..if makes sense. Believe the alliance has/had some kind of the same manner of things, can remember what it was called, but wasnt set to 1-2-3-4 guilds, but singles and odds and ends, long as they knew what they were doing.

I'll back you up as much as I can (breakage atm tho..uni etc, so maybe around 2-3 weeks) and naturally take up a dps spot on snub or ven...with ven as preference really. Have some healing gear, think gets to 1300+ tho, so...tis crappy.

I'll copy/move this post over to under contruction too, see if people can get more feedback onto you too

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Rayaleith

I do have the gear for healing, and am Holy at this moment. Yet I have had that in mind to respec prot as I don't find it fun to be a healer any longer... and as fun is what I really want, that is why I have considered to respec yet I still lack the gear for it having only few at hand already.

More importantly is the connection I am using, as the weekdays I'm spending at the institute where the wireless con is in use for every student and knowing there might be few who are sometimes downloading something the lag and latency gets insane at times, and sometimes it takes hours for the connection to even work at there. But at home it is stable.

Might be available for one to two runs in a week, after these studies are over. Though I am not really that active on Raya anyway, still I would like to keep raiding with my paladin whenever I can, and have the time and willpower to do that. Afterall I wish to have fun in this game. And if I can't find it while being a protadin, then I think I'll move on to another servers to play my alts and will keep Raya in DB if I ever wish to play with her again.

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Glademist

Yes, raya, i have put you in the healing group for now, but you will naturally have the greatest chance to get quality tank gear while healing since i am not sure about the gear you allready have for the prot tree.
You can show me anytime ingame
And once you and m are happy with the prot gear stats we will move you towards tnaks. Fair?

__________________
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Time is the fire in which we burn.

Glademist

Also if you have an idea about loot assignment please be creative and post here. Not everyone likes every version of the dkp system and the one i will post here soonish might not be to everyones liking.

__________________
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Time is the fire in which we burn.

Rayaleith

Currently my tanking gear sucks bad as I only got some three purples, few blues and missing loads of other. Would require badges and rep and stuff to get my tanking gear complete.

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Glademist

Well i am usually up for a heroic instance, so if you are online i will gladly help with the badge gathering.

__________________
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Time is the fire in which we burn.

Paladis

Xqa can be available as often as possible...admittedly at the moment RL has me xtra busy with work and looking to move house but i'll try to be as active as possible so mark the old git Xqanoth down for a spot.

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Snubson

Couple of things; maybe cut the dkp in kara to 2 points for Aran (generally 1/2 way through) and 4 for prince, with nothing awarded for the others. Most of the others are alright just getting the easy badges.

Other than that....looks good dont write off snub fully as enh dps mind, ven isn't geared fully to my liking for 1k dps so can't do the same output (yet).

I'll put more info when actually on my pc and not on phone.

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Sage

Hullo,

Silversage and Mierka are in. Silver's tnakking with 31.000 armor and gear for Hydross, Mierka's healing with 2000+ healing bonus. Also, Silver kittyizes decently, can't remember AP though at the moment. For respeccing, Silver could heal with crappy 1000 +heal, if I recall correctly Mierka is not interested in respeccing.


Mm, I don't get your DKP system tbh: First you say prices, and then you say bidding. So what do I pay for my sparklin' T5 shoulders; the T5 token price or some other price determined by bids? No idea.


Personally, I would remove Karazhan and Zul'aman from the DKP race entirely, since they work without. Of course handing out DKP for them may provide incentive for old farts to gear up nawbs, but then again the 22 badges do the same trick. In my opinion, only use DKP when you must -- and I agree in 25-mans you pretty much have to.


Finally, alliances of guilds have a tendency to suck due to people being stuck in their political parties. When Dude A and Dude B get into an argument, it becomes an issue of 40 people as Guilds X and Y get involved. If we have a strong dicatator, we should get rid of the guild pressure. In essence, if idiot C belongs to guild X and most of guild X members are raiding with us, there should be no absolute pressure for us to keep C in (or to get officers of X involved in the mess). Also, that'd mean that person D who's an officer of Y wouldn't necessarily be a major head honcho in the raid alliance.


Anyway, it's your show now, so I'm happy to support whatever decisions are made by a properly functioning dictatorship. "Long Live Gladey The First!"


Sage

Zagar

I will have to agree that dkp use in Kara and ZA is... not good. We need to get people geared, so if loads of stuff for them drops, they shouldn't get negative dkp. And I think awarding dkp for kara and ZA is a no no too. For if dkp was awarded if the 10-mans, we would get dkp farmers rather than people actually gearing up their chars.

Zagar

Oh and as the list says, I am prot. And have no wish of respecc'ing. Tanking is fun! \o/

Glademist

I need to keep Kara and Zul in to motivate the people to raid and to help improve the lower geared people. They can get the loot from badges even when ending in minus after one Kara run. And the prices from Karazhan will be kept to keep the people in the idea of the dkp and that they have to do something for it to gain something. Could be removed in future or after larger discussion about cons and pros.

Bidding.. well the idea was to let the people bid for their item at the start price, and either win it if they want it alone, or take a roll with other interested. Unless they would want to spend more dkp to get the item eliminating the other interested from the game. So for sparkling T5 token you would "bid" the starting price of 40 dkp. And if you were the only one interested, would get it for the price. Now considering you wanted the item badly and had the dkp for it, you could raise the price to a double DKP. The others would either have to raise too to get a chance to roll, or would have to pass. As i said this is an idea how to allow people get their items if they raid frequently while not allowing them to stack thousands of DKP.

__________________
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Time is the fire in which we burn.

Mierka

Like Silver already said, I'm game as well!

Healer - not planning to respec evah - healing is my thing.
Bring the progress raids! *has small flags*

I'm against kara and ZA dkp/loot rules, since I am fairly sure it will cause more problems than give us back. But that's just me. I'm not saying we couldnt try it - but I see very little actual gains and I do believe that using dkp WILL slow gearing up down remarkably.

Otherways the idea of dkp prices, gains and bidding seems nice - but I'm not sure how well the bidding might work in practice. However I'm ready to give it a try ;-) so let's get the raiding rolling! ;-)

I'm a gonna heal you through what ever, posse! :-)

-mier-